רציתי להראות לציבור שזה בסדר להיות בעלת מבנה גוף “שונה” ולעסוק בענפי ספורט שאינם “נשיים”

[Grizzly Bear]

זאת לא הדוגמא הכי טובה מכוון שבעבר גילוי עריות היה דבר מאוד מקובל ואילו מלכים שהיו נחשבים לבעלי הדם הכחול עשו זאת מתוך הגיון מסויים ( שאולי היום היום הוכח לנו כפסול אבל בעבר היה נחשב כשר)
בקשר לכתבה ,קראתי אותה ובאמת שנראה שהיא אומרת מלא דברים סתם לקדם את עצמה ולאחר שיחה עם אחותי שאשכרה ראתה את הסדרה מבתבר שבאמת אף אחד לא אכפת כול כך מימנה

למה זה נחשב פסול לעשות את זה?

 

[iziktan]

למה זה נחשב פסול לעשות את זה?

גילוי עריות?
כי זה לרוב יוצר מוטציות גנטיות.
עם זה בהקשר לדיון פה הנורמה השתנתה ולפי הגיון החדש שלה זה פסול(הדת אומרת שלא , זה מגעיל אותי, זה יוצר יחסים מעוותים בין האם והבן)

 

[AQUANGEL]

אני מוצא כל כך הרבה אירוניה בכתבה באתר להטבי על אישה שמשתמשת בטסטוסטרון אבל מגדירה את עצמה כאישה.

 

[Grizzly Bear]

גילוי עריות?
כי זה לרוב יוצר מוטציות גנטיות.
עם זה בהקשר לדיון פה הנורמה השתנתה ולפי הגיון החדש שלה זה פסול(הדת אומרת שלא , זה מגעיל אותי, זה יוצר יחסים מעוותים בין האם והבן)

אז אם להשתמש באמצעי מניעה אין בעיה עם זה?

 

[iziktan]

אז אם להשתמש באמצעי מניעה אין בעיה עם זה?

ראה שאר התגובה לתשובה

 

[Grizzly Bear]

ראה שאר התגובה לתשובה

מי קובע שהיחסים הופכים מעוותים? אתה? למה אתה קובע שהיחסים של אנשים כלשהם הם מעוותים ולא מקובלים? הרי הם לא פוגעים באף אחד.

 

[iziktan]

מי קובע שהיחסים הופכים מעוותים? אתה? למה אתה קובע שהיחסים של אנשים כלשהם הם מעוותים ולא מקובלים? הרי הם לא פוגעים באף אחד.

קרא את הודעה שוב בחברה אומרת את הדברים אני פשוט מדגים לך מה היא אומרת בקשר זה ומה הסיבות שלה לנורמה ששוללת זאת . אני בחיים לא אמרתי שאני בעד או נגד זה אתה פשוט מוציא את דברים שאמרתי מקשרים. (דרך זה מאוד מוזר לי שאתה עושה בלתחשב בזה שלפניו דקה הגנתה על הנורמה של החברה הטענה שיש היגיון בריא מאחוריה)

 

[Grizzly Bear]

קרא את הודעה שוב בחברה אומרת את הדברים אני פשוט מדגים לך מה היא אומרת בקשר זה ומה הסיבות שלה לנורמה ששוללת זאת . אני בחיים לא אמרתי שאני בעד או נגד זה אתה פשוט מוציא את דברים שאמרתי מקשרים. (דרך זה מאוד מוזר לי שאתה עושה בלתחשב בזה שלפניו דקה הגנתה על הנורמה של החברה הטענה שיש היגיון בריא מאחוריה)

זאת הייתה ציניות כי זה בדרך כלל מה שטוענים אלה שרוצים שכולם יקבלו את הנטיות שלהם. מבחינתי אין הבדל בין הדוגמא שנתתי להומואים ולסביות.

 

[MonkeyD]

מי קובע שהיחסים הופכים מעוותים? אתה? למה אתה קובע שהיחסים של אנשים כלשהם הם מעוותים ולא מקובלים? הרי הם לא פוגעים באף אחד.

אתה מתנהג כמו 2 אנשים ממשתמש אחד...

זאת הייתה ציניות כי זה בדרך כלל מה שטוענים אלה שרוצים שכולם יקבלו את הנטיות שלהם. מבחינתי אין הבדל בין הדוגמא שנתתי להומואים ולסביות.

אז כל זה היה טרול? 🫤

 

[iziktan]

זאת הייתה ציניות כי זה בדרך כלל מה שטוענים אלה שרוצים שכולם יקבלו את הנטיות שלהם. מבחינתי אין הבדל בין הדוגמא שנתתי להומואים ולסביות.

K
זאת דעה שלך אבל אפשר פה לדיון אחר . הרי הסכמנו שנינו שכול עוד הדבר לא פוגע באדם אחר אין שום בעיה איתו אבל האם אפשר להגיד אותו דבר לגבי דעות?
הרי יש הרבה אנשים שיגידו שהדעה שלך בעצם פוגעת בהקהילה הגאה כי אתה משווה אותם הקהילה הגאה (שעד היום לא יצא מחקר אחד רציני שמראה שיש נזק ביחסים חד מיניים כול שהוא לא לזוג עצמו לא לחברה או לילדים של הזוג הגאה) לבין גילוי עריות ( שכן יש מחקרים ספרים ודעות מדעיות שגילוי עיריות דופק בצורה כזאת או אחרת את המשתתפים בה) וכך תורם בעקיפין למניעת זכות השיוון שלהם.
מה שמעלה עוד שאלה עד אפשר להגן על שאף אחד לא יפגע עד שזה נהפך לפישזם כי תכלס זאת דעתך ולכן אמור להיות לך החופש לבטא אותה

 

[Grizzly Bear]

K
זאת דעה שלך אבל אפשר פה לדיון אחר . הרי הסכמנו שנינו שכול עוד הדבר לא פוגע באדם אחר אין שום בעיה איתו אבל האם אפשר להגיד אותו דבר לגבי דעות?
הרי יש הרבה אנשים שיגידו שהדעה שלך בעצם פוגעת בהקהילה הגאה כי אתה משווה אותם הקהילה הגאה (שעד היום לא יצא מחקר אחד רציני שמראה שיש נזק ביחסים חד מיניים כול שהוא לא לזוג עצמו לא לחברה או לילדים של הזוג הגאה) לבין גילוי עריות ( שכן יש מחקרים ספרים ודעות מדעיות שגילוי עיריות דופק בצורה כזאת או אחרת את המשתתפים בה) וכך תורם בעקיפין למניעת זכות השיוון שלהם.
מה שמעלה עוד שאלה עד אפשר להגן על שאף אחד לא יפגע עד שזה נהפך לפישזם כי תכלס זאת דעתך ולכן אמור להיות לך החופש לבטא אותה

אני רוצה לראות את המחקרים שמראים שגילוי רעיות גורם לנזק גם אם לא מביאים ילדים.

 

[iziktan]

אני רוצה לראות את המחקרים שמראים שגילוי רעיות גורם לנזק גם אם לא מביאים ילדים.

k
חכה אני יערוך

http://www.lotscave.com/files/Journal of Genetic Counseling (Vol. 11, No. 2, April 4, 2002).pdf

ST. LOUIS — It probably isn't surprising to hear that women who were victims of incest as children are more likely to suffer disabling psychiatric problems than other women.

What is surprising is that little has been documented about the long-term effects of childhood sexual abuse.

Those were the findings of a study by Stephen Dinwiddie and Elizabeth Pribor, researchers and teachers at the Washington University School of Medicine in St. Louis.

"This very basic descriptive study was designed to see if we can put some numbers and some percentages on what is a general perception," Dinwiddie said. What Dinwiddie and Pribor learned in their study, published earlier this year in the American Journal of Psychiatry, will surprise few.

"The impact of child psychiatric trauma is a very important factor in the development of serious disorders in children and in adults," said Linda Smith, a psychotherapist in the department of psychiatry at St. Louis University Medical Center.

There is a great deal of anecdotal literature that ties incest to psychiatric problems, Smith said, but "it can be very helpful to put it in the scientific arena."

It's been difficult to research the prevalence and long-term effect of incest and sexual abuse because the victims often feel ashamed and stigmatized. "These are people who have learned from a very young and vulnerable age that you just don't talk about it," Dinwiddie said.

By age 16, one woman in five has had sexual contact with a relative, and one in three has had unwanted sexual contact with an adult, the researchers said.

In their study of 75 area women receiving psychotherapy, Dinwiddie and Pribor found the 52 incest victims in that group each, on average, had suffered seven psychiatric illnesses, more than twice the number suffered by the 23 women who hadn't been sexually abused as children.

The incest victims also suffered certain psychiatric disorders more frequently than did the other women.

The incest victims most often suffered alcohol dependence, depression, panic attacks and phobias, especially a fear of public places--all potentially disabling and all highly treatable.

While Pribor and Dinwiddie don't claim to have found a link between severity of abuse and depth of illness, they did find that the women who had been most severely abused had higher levels of anxiety-related problems.

Despite results that seem to confirm assumptions, Dinwiddie remains cautious.

"It's premature to try to propose some simple cause-and-effect relationship between this kind of trauma and the development of mental illness," he said.

The researchers also learned that of the 24 women who previously had received therapy, 21 weren't satisfied with their treatment. They said their counselors dismissed sexual abuse as a possible reason for their problems.

Unlike their therapists, the women themselves "saw incest as something massive, painful and terrible--an issue important for them to address," Dinwiddie said.

In part because it can remove some of the stigma associated with incest, therapists should ask everyone they treat if they've been sexually abused, the researchers recommended.

Phyllis Froehle, vice president of Voices in Action, an international organization of incest and sexual abuse survivors based in Chicago, agrees therapists must ask everyone about abuse.

Not until she was an adult did a question from a therapist help her recall that she'd been sexually abused as

Incest and its effects

Child abuse of any kind by a parent is a particularly negative experience that often affects survivors to varying degrees throughout their lives. However, child sexual abuse committed by a parent or other relative — that is, incest — is associated with particularly severe psychological symptoms and physical injuries for many survivors. For example, survivors of father-daughter incest are more likely to report feeling depressed, damaged and psychologically injured than are survivors of other types of child abuse. They are also more likely to report being estranged from one or both parents and having been shamed by others when they tried to share their experience. Additional symptoms include low self-esteem, self-loathing, somatization, low self-efficacy, pervasive interpersonal difficulties and feelings of contamination, worthlessness, shame and helplessness.

One particularly damaging result of incest is trauma bonding, in which survivors incorporate the aberrant views of their abusers about the incestuous relationship. As a result, victims frequently associate the abuse with a distorted form of caring and affection that later negatively influences their choice of romantic relationships. This can often lead to entering a series of abusive relationships.

According to Christine Courtois (Healing the Incest Wound: Adult Survivors in Therapy) and Richard Kluft (“Ramifications of incest” in Psychiatric Times), greater symptom severity for incest survivors is associated with:

• Longer duration of abuse
• Frequent abuse episodes
• Penetration
• High degree of force, coercion and intimidation
• Transgenerational incest
• A male perpetrator
• Closeness of the relationship
• Passive or willing participation
• Having an erotic response
• Self-blame and shame
• Observed or reported incest that continues
• Parental blame and negative judgment
• Failed institutional responses: shaming, blaming, ineffectual effort
• Early childhood onset

Incest that begins at a young age and continues for protracted periods — the average length of incest abuse is four years — often results in avoidance-based coping skills (for example, avoidance of relationships and various dissociative phenomena). These trauma-forged coping skills form the foundation for present and future interpersonal interactions and often become first-line responses to all or most levels of distress-producing circumstances.

More than any other type of child abuse, incest is associated with secrecy, betrayal, powerlessness, guilt, conflicted loyalty, fear of reprisal and self-blame/shame. It is of little surprise then that only 30 percent of incest cases are reported by survivors. The most reliable research suggests that 1 in 20 families with a female child have histories of father-daughter child sexual abuse, whereas 1 in 7 blended families with a female child have experienced stepfather-stepdaughter child sexual abuse (see the revised edition of The Secret Trauma: Incest in the Lives of Girls and Women by Diana E. H. Russell, published in 1999).

In 1986, David Finkelhor, known for his work on child sexual abuse, indicated that among males who reported being sexually abused as children, 3 percent reported mother-son incest. However, most incest-related research has focused on father-daughter or stepfather-stepdaughter incest, which is the focus of this article.

Subsequent studies of incest survivors indicated that being eroticized early in life disrupted these individuals’ adult sexuality. In comparison with nonincest controls, survivors experienced sexual intercourse earlier, had more sex partners, were more likely to have casual sex with those outside of their primary relationships and were more likely to engage in sex for money. Thus, survivors of incest are at an increased risk for revictimization, often without a conscious realization that they are being abused. This issue often creates confusion for survivors because the line between involuntary and voluntary participation in sexual behavior is blurred.

An article by Sandra Stroebel and colleagues, published in 2013 in Sexual Abuse: A Journal of Research and Treatment, indicates that risk factors for father-daughter incest include the following:

• Exposure to parent verbal or physical violence
• Families that accept father-daughter nudity
• Families in which the mother never kisses or hugs her daughter (overt maternal affection was identified as a protective factor against father-daughter incest)
• Families with an adult male other than the biological father in the home (i.e., a stepfather or substitute father figure)

Finally, some qualitative research notes that in limited cases, mothers with histories of being sexually abused as a child wittingly or unwittingly contribute to the causal chain of events leading to father-daughter incest. Furthermore, in cases in which a mother chooses the abuser over her daughter, the abandonment by the mother may have a greater negative impact on her daughter than did the abuse itself. This rejection not only reinforces the victim’s sense of worthlessness and shame but also suggests to her that she somehow “deserved” the abuse. As a result, revictimization often becomes the rule rather than the exception, a self-fulfilling prophecy that validates the victim’s sense of core unworthiness.

Beyond the physical and psychological harm caused by father-daughter incest, Courtois notes that the resulting family dynamics are characterized by:

• Parent conflict
• Contradicting messages
• Triangulation (for example, parents aligned against the child or perpetrator parent-child alignment against the other parent)
• Improper parent-child alliances within an atmosphere of denial and secrecy

Furthermore, victims are less likely to receive support and protection due to family denial and loyalty than if the abuser were outside the family or a stranger. Together, these circumstances often create for survivors a distorted sense of self and distorted relationships with self and others. If the incest begins at an early age, survivors often develop an inherent sense of mistrust and danger that pervades and mediates their perceptions of relationships and the world as a whole

Sexually abused children report and/or display affective, cognitive, physical, and behavioral symptoms (Shaw et al. 2000). Symptoms may include general behavior problems, delinquency, anxiety, regressive behaviors, nightmares, withdrawal from normal activities, internalizing and externalizing disorders, cruelty and self-injury, post-traumatic stress disorder, poor self-esteem, and age-inappropriate sexual behavior. A review of forty-five studies indicated two common patterns of psychological response to incest (Williams and Finkelhor 1993). The first are those associated with posttraumatic stress symptomology. The second is an increase in sexualized behaviors, including sexualized play with dolls, putting objects into anuses or vaginas, excessive or public masturbation, seductive behavior, and age-inappropriate sexual knowledge and behavior.

Long-term psychological sequelae of incest include depression, anxiety, psychiatric hospitalization, drug and alcohol use, suicidality, borderline personality disorder, somatization disorder, and eroticization (Schetky 1990; Silverman, Reinherz, and Giaconia 1996). Common, too, are learning difficulties, posttraumatic stress disorder, dissociative disorders and conversion reactions, running away, prostitution, re-victimization, poor parenting, and an increased likelihood of becoming a perpetrator. The frequency and severity of psychological sequelae secondary to sexual abuse has been related to frequency and duration of the abuse, relationship to the perpetrator, use of force, type of sexual abuse, penetration, age of the victim, age difference between victim and offender, and the parental support variable (Schetky 1990). Most incest victims experience confusion about their own reactions to the incest experience. It is this betrayal of innocence and resultant confusion, along with the loss of control and power over one's own behavior, that lead to the emotional and psychological impact on the victim. Victims often experience, both at the time of the incestuous act and later as adults, a sense of shame, a feeling of powerlessness, and a loss of their childhood.

Sibling incest is often thought to be the least harmful form. Although one of the key aspects of incest is the difference in power between the perpetrator and the victim, sexual behavior between two siblings of equal power, where touching, looking, and exploring are mutual decisions, can still pose problems for the participants and/or parents. What Diana Russell (1986) calls the myth of mutuality in relation to sibling incest may put the victim in a psychologically and physically vulnerable position. In her research with adult women, she found that 78 percent of her subjects who had had childhood sexual experiences reported that their sexual behavior with brothers was abusive. When the reported sexual behavior was with a sister, 50 percent of the female subjects experienced the behavior as abusive. Approximately one-half reported sibling incest as extremely upsetting, and another one-fourth as somewhat upsetting. The degree of coercion and the emotional harm in sibling incest may be more underestimated than incest in general.

The effects of sexual abuse on children and their later development into adulthood depend on at least five important factors: the age of the child, the duration of the abuse, the type of the abuse, the manner in which the child frames the abuse, and the ability of the child to heal. It is likely that there are important gender differences in how girls and boys make sense out of incest experiences. Girls tend to view the incest experience within the larger context of the child-adult relationship and are likely to be more concerned with the perpetrator's feelings and family stability. In contrast, a boy may focus more on his own sexual experience. All children, whether male or female, attempt to make sense of or to create an explanation for the incestuous relationship as a part of the healing process.

The ability of people to heal from a damaging experience is related to their ability to confront their own feelings of fear, terror, anger, rage, confusion, helplessness, and vulnerability. A common report of adult victims of childhood incest is a clear sense of removing oneself from the event. A sense that it was being done to someone else and/or a sense of leaving the body during the sexual contact are common reports. The danger is that denial becomes the preferred or most common behavior to deal with stress. Moving beyond denial to healing requires that the incest victims allow themselves to experience the feelings of confusion, rage, and helplessness.

To manipulate the victim, most incest perpetrators foster in the child a set of behaviors that help the child maintain the denial and self-deception needed to survive an ongoing incestuous relationship. The effects of this on the victim can be manifested in multiple ways, including fear of violence, sex, intimacy, and people of the same sex as the perpetrator. Confusion of gender identity, as well as uncontrolled sexual activity, may also result. There is often a need to care for and control others, at home, school, and work. Feelings of isolation, shame, and guilt, often not associated with any specific activity, help to foster a poor self-image, which may lead to suicidal behavior. There is also a tendency for victims of incest to suffer from other disorders, such as sleep disturbances, nightmares, depression, and eating disorders. Incestuous relationships are at a minimum a contributing factor to the above effects, and for countless victims, they are the primary contributor.

Part of the process of healing is the victim's awareness of the context within which he or she made choices. Often, in treatment, victims gain a sense of empowerment when they can begin to trace the development of the incestuous relationship over time. Typically, victims can account for a gradual increase in their ability to make choices and implement them. Victims have often stated that at a certain time, they were able to stop the incest perpetrator's manipulations with the threat of breaking secrecy.

https://ac.els-cdn.com/S2090536X163...t=1544204962_477b49304d04ccd65359bbcee1f85088
https://ac.els-cdn.com/S2090536X163...t=1544204962_477b49304d04ccd65359bbcee1f85088
(זה בהקשר להיריון שנוצר ב מגילוי העיריות אבל לפי דעתי זה עדיין מהנושא)

file:///C:/Users/avi/Downloads/UBC_1989_A5%20P74%20(1).pdf

http://www.psychiatrictimes.com/sexual-offenses/ramifications-incest

יש עוד בהזדמנות אני יביא עוד אניפשוט לא רוצה למשוך את העמוד עוד סתם
*ערה*- כפי שאתה רואה ברבה מקרים מתייחסים עליהם כ''קרבנות גילוי עריות'' זה מכוון שגילוי עריות יוצר בעיות רבות בהמשך החיים כמו אי יכולת תקשורת חברתית תקינה , קושי בהבנה עצמית ודיכאון.
*עוד הערה מדובר רק בגיולי עריות עם קרובי משפחה מדרגה ראשונה כהורה - בן אח - אחות. וכול הקורבנות היו מודעים לקרבה לפניי קיום יחסי המין או אהבה.

 

[MasterSplitter]

שכל אחד יעשה מה שבא לו כל עוד זה חוקי, לא מבין מה זה מפריע.